Russian Shasqua

A forum for Polish and other Eastern European saber systems.
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Tyler Brandon
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Russian Shasqua

Postby Tyler Brandon » Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:21 pm

Image

So, in our study of Polish and Eastern European saber we have dug up a lot of information on Russian techniques. We have decided to post the results of our research for everyone to see and add to here in one spot. As the videos show; cuts from the draw, wide stances, fast footwork, voiding, and deflection parries are central characteristics. Another possible feature is the relation between fencing and the sword dance in the former Russian Empire and USSR. In a vintage British training video shows the Scottish sword dance was taught to aid in building suppleness and dexterity. Eastern sword dances appear to do this but also teach style and fencing techniques.

Treatises

Knizhka dlja molodih soldat kavalerii - 1887
The Book for Young Cavalry Soldiers and Cossacks, written by Captain Krestovski (1887)

in 2 Parts
http://kazachiy-krug.ru/stati/istorija/ ... -kavalerii
http://kazachiy-krug.ru/stati/istorija/ ... alerii-452

http://www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/vi ... 22&t=19342

A. V. Suvorov's Regimental Institution circa 1763-1768 Russian Military Manual
http://adjudant.ru/suvorov/suzd00.htm

Обучение рубке и уколам
Пособіе для офицеровъ Главной фехтовально-гимнастической школы
.
А. И. Грековъ. , С.Петербург, 1912 г.

Cutting and Thrusting Instructions: Manual for the Officers of the Head Fencing and Gymnastics School
A. I. Grekov, St. Petersburg 1912
http://lib.rus.ec/b/146349/read

http://www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/vi ... 23&t=19360

Уставъ строевой казачьей службы, Часть I, С.Петербург, 1889
Regulations for Cossacks, Part I, St. Petersburgh, 1889
original by S. S. Makarov
http://www.scarb.ru/literatura/metodich ... j-sluzhby/
http://www.scarb.ru/literatura/metodich ... luzhby1-2/
http://www.scarb.ru/literatura/metodich ... luzhby1-5/

http://www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/vi ... 22&t=19359

Начертание правил фехтовального искусства
An Outline of the Rules of Fencing, With Sketches, In Five Parts. By the Assistant to the Principal Fencing-master of the Separate Corps of Guards, St. Petersburg, Sokolov, 1843
http://www.reenactor.ru/ARH/Drill/Pravila_Fext_1843.pdf

http://www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/vi ... 22&t=19378

Проект обучения фехтованию на эспадронах в кавалерийских частях, в пешем строю и на конях: 1892 X — 1893 IV / Штабс-ротмистр Катков. — СПб.: Типо-лит. Р. Голике, 1893.
Project learning fencing saber in cavalry units, on foot and on horseback: 1892 X - 1893 IV / Staff-Captain Katkov. - St. Petersburg.: Frame lit. R. Golicke, 1893.
The French translation of this book (1895) is available at: http://jfgilles.perso.sfr.fr/escrime/bi ... index.html

It was written by Па́вел Миха́йлович Катко́в (князь Катко́в-Ша́ликов) (1856-1930) Pavel M Katkov (or in French version Katkoff), Russian general.



Other treatise information can be found in the below locations.

Information of Published Pre-Revolutionary Russian Fencing Works
http://fencing-future.com/cntnt/eng/feh ... nye_1.html

The Great Soviet Encyclopedia (1979) has led me to some older Russian texts back to 1571!
"The first Russian military regulations date from the 16th and 17th centuries and include The Boyars’ Rules of Stanitsa Guard Service (1571), Regulations Concerning Combat Cannon and Other Matters Which Relate to Military Science (1607 and 1621; 2nd ed., parts 1–2, 1777–81), and The Science and Technique of Infantry Combat Formations (1647). For the regular army, Peter I drafted the Army Regulations in 1716. From the 18th to the beginning of the 20th century, military regulations in the Russian army were issued on several occasions."

"The Petrine regulations included military legislation such as the Army Regulations (1716), the Regulations for the Land Forces (1716), and the Naval Regulations (1720); the General Regulation, which established the collegiums (1720); the Spiritual Regulation for the Synod (1721); the Regulations for the Chief Magistracy (1721); and the Admiralty Regulation (1722). The tsar, the chief administrators of the state, and representatives of the social estates (the dvorianstvo [nobility and gentry], merchants, and clergy) wrote the regulations, which adapted the norms of Western European legislation to Russian conditions."

I am still trying to track down the original Russian versions and/or translations. But if the oldest have any info on weapons usage it should be right what we have been looking for. More people looking = better chance of finding.

Some Threads, related to Russian/Cossack swordsmanship in various ways.

http://www.swordforum.com/forums/showth ... sack-Saber
http://www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/vi ... =3&t=17832
http://www.military-quotes.com/forum/sw ... 89839.html
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=2572&p=36259#p36259

Edit: Added

http://www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/vi ... 31&t=13674
http://www.fioredeiliberi.org/phpBB3/vi ... 31&t=19357

Shasqua Videos, both of vintage videos, modern practitioners from both historic fencing, inclusion in modern combatives, reenactors, and theatrical groups.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StucLOl- ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qy7LxBH ... re=related (Good example of deflection parries)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StucLOl-Z-Y&feature=plcp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cFMGOlp ... ure=fvwrel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNUz-EvB ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80NcFBGM ... e=youtu.be (test cutting)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RY7-L20E59w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGEDoemL ... re=related
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2347&start=80
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEE1hswJZl4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uvJyEhdkb8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVPFDuI5 ... ults_video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVPFDuI5zs0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9n_b3vZ4 ... r_embedded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSXEicQC ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_YCcE9d ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDTiZVHGcwc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZV2SkVv ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHENCw9ki5U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtNt01zUTIQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEh6cGLlUjU
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/russi ... rs-in-iran
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/trick-riders
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/sovie ... -in-red-sq (Soviet Cultural parade)
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/cossa ... -the-dance


Also videos of traditional Cossacks games, SHERMITSII.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZOtImWq ... creen&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEh6cGLlUjU (TWO shasquas duel wield.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alK8fmselkU (obstacle course with 2 shasquas.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zcqcXGM9TQ (1 shasqua vs 2 peaks (I guess spears?))
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZOtImWq-84
Last edited by Tyler Brandon on Sat Jul 13, 2013 10:05 am, edited 3 times in total.
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John P
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Re: Russian Shasqua

Postby John P » Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:13 pm

Cool. It's going to take me a while to work through all this.

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Tyler Brandon
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Re: Russian Shasqua

Postby Tyler Brandon » Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:27 pm

JohnPatterson wrote:Cool. It's going to take me a while to work through all this.


Well, now it's here in this handy thread and rather than just spread all over the Eastern European Saber thread so that should make it easier. :D
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Re: Russian Shasqua

Postby Ben Floyd » Sun Nov 04, 2012 12:28 pm

Image

$575. Condition is... not awesome. But, it's still really cool.

More pics:
http://www.faganarms.com/Cossack/caucas ... 9-627.aspx
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Tyler Brandon
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Re: Russian Shasqua

Postby Tyler Brandon » Sat Nov 10, 2012 6:29 pm

Ulrich von L...n wrote:This very bad picture is just a tantalising proof of existence of another illustrated Russian manual.

Beneath the foreground sheet one could see the partial title of Обучение рубке и уколам (Grekov's manual, 1912). It might be that these drawings are from Grekov's book, because it is possible to recognise some Italian sabre guards: 3rd (Fig. 32), 4th (Fig. 34.), 1st or 2nd - hard to tell (Fig. 33), and in 1909 Grekov translated Barbasetti's book and provided it with comments.

Барбазетти, Луиджи Фехтование на саблях / Луиджи Барбазетти; Пер. с коммент. А.К. Грекова, под ред. Л.В. Де-Витт
Санкт-Петербург : изд. при содействии С.-Петерб. офиц. фехтов. гимнаст. зала, 1909

Or the Russian translation of Barbasetti's book. Or it could be a completely unknown Russian fencing manual.


Some Russian Titles awaiting scanning.
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Hikaru Sulu: Fencing.

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Tyler Brandon
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Re: Russian Shasqua

Postby Tyler Brandon » Sat Jul 13, 2013 10:01 am

New from SG, also added above.

Ulrich von L...n wrote:A fascinating new Russian fencing book with 40 superb illustrations has been located by Max C.

Проект обучения фехтованию на эспадронах в кавалерийских частях, в пешем строю и на конях: 1892 X — 1893 IV / Штабс-ротмистр Катков. — СПб.: Типо-лит. Р. Голике, 1893.
The French translation of this book (1895) is available at: http://jfgilles.perso.sfr.fr/escrime/bibliotheque/katkoff/index.html

It was written by Па́вел Миха́йлович Катко́в (князь Катко́в-Ша́ликов) (1856-1930) Pavel M Katkov (or in French version Katkoff), Russian general.

http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D0% ... 0%B8%D1%87

More info on his military career (in Russian):
http://regiment.ru/bio/K/35.htm
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Re: Russian Shasqua

Postby Richard Marsden » Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:20 pm

Great find as always. If we get a Russian guy who can translate, he could spearhead the Russian free PDF project!

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Tyler Brandon
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Re: Russian Shasqua

Postby Tyler Brandon » Tue Jul 16, 2013 12:36 pm

Richard Marsden wrote:Great find as always. If we get a Russian guy who can translate, he could spearhead the Russian free PDF project!


Thanks and certainly. The new one is in French though.
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